73 replies to this topic

[the_witty_welshman]

Is this possible? the auction states LATEST FRUIT MACHINE EMPTIERS for S16 £500
This guide contains information on how to empty:

ASTRA SECTION 16'S. That is Party Time Slotto - Little Devils etc
BFM SECTION 16'S e.g. Random Spinner - High Roller etc
NOVOGAMINGS MAGIC GAMES EMPTIER (untill now this hasent been sold anywhere!)
Surely this cant be true?

[the_witty_welshman]

because surely they wouldnt be as many of them still around? section 16 would be changing the programming or something straight away?

[RegularPlayer]

You mean this product:

http://cgi.ebay.co.u...RK:MESE:IT&rd=1

I did actually purchase this guide about a week ago: although its not 100% miracle status info - I have made a steady profit from several of the guides.

Now there is a "make an offer" option - it might be worth having a go.

Thats my oppinion anyway. seller was freindly also.

[skabaz]

most of the section 16's have been chipped recently.

well ours have anyway.

baz

[nails]

s16 machines have been debaited many many times here. i dont want to really go over old stuff here, but this is how i see it (this example with party SLUTTO)

imagine lots of bingo balls in a bag, lots and lots. they comprise of lots of losing balls, lots of 50p £1 £1,50 ans £2 balls, as we go up the chaim there are less £5 £6 etc and a few £25 balls.

as you play away, and ultimately lose more money, different balls are added to the bag. oout of thousands of balls, ther manybe one £500 balls. they more you play (£100`s of pounds) the £500 balls are added to this imaginary bag.

Party SLUTTO does however tens to give away when there is something in the pipeline. the reels go a fraction slower, and the adding up of the wins gets slower and slower untill you either get a few £25`s or you hit the JP. (i played one a few days ago in crawley. my first spin was really really slow, as was the £1.50 i won. a mere 5 spin later it gave me the JP)

now, imagine that not every JP ball picked is exactly £500, imagine one was £1000 or even £1500. this is how it can do the treble. we proved this in my local arcade. the operator was able to determine within a day of each other, when the jp was going to drop, which defies the logic of a random machine.
Since ive just got rid of my reflex vegas £500, i was able to practice the theory, and sure enough, within .5 of a percent, i knew when it was going to drop a jp (a close run of high wins can act as a mini jackpot and remove your chance of getting the true jp)

now back to this thread about s16 emptier system, i was working on a system for the fortune500 magic500 vegas500 machines. I was 99% there but gave up, as although it was a great system, i just could not be 100% that it always worked, but if you do know the machines then try to understand that it was a percentage cockup to get a free jp. thats why i come up with the understanding that random machines (it general NOT all) are only 100% random within their parameters.

i know this will stir a few ppl up again. but you cant help the way you feel. Barcrests Cashino had an early problem - it gave too many jackpots from the roulette board, simply because of a percentage cockup. slutto and random spinner however was down to the programmers either `sloppy` or purpose built emptier systems. it is however strange how monkey business, spinner and sluttos systems all came out at the same time, and all are independant manufacturers. There IS a problem with elvis with the top box, the owner of the local arcade and all of his affiliates have either removed the top box or turned the machnie off all together untill a resolution is made.

I doubt that any of the systems avail on this 9.99 disk work, though regularplayer recons hes still making a profit out of it..

[nails]

the magic games emptier has been out for a year now, since ive included it on the golden game disk, i know exactley what it is.

slotto/devils - rechipped. on the older model that it worked on you may find that some arcades have disabled he collect button.

random spinner - 10p trick long gone

bar x - the chances of finding the mab chip with a single ZERO are... zero!

latest AWP emptiers - bet he doesnt even know the old extreme emptier trick

save your money mates, that is unless regularplayer can prove me wrong..

[skabaz]

the exteme keying emptier should now be long gone as most machines have been chipped.

i'm sure this was an inside job through barcrest as it seems to be horizon cabinets that are constantly being rechipped.

baz

[RegularPlayer]

Hello All..

First Up thank you too nails - the above is the best explanation of the workings of S16'S I have read to date.

The only thing that leaves me a little confused about S16's is the fact they can quite often go short on a small float - I would have thought that will there advanced (ish) programming they would be protected from this, however they do this more often than any AWP for example.

As for the guide - I have found several of the low tech emptiers the most profitable - I also used the Magic Games trick last weekend in a local sega park - but alot are chipped.

ermm.. I dont feel the need to defend this guide!! its not great.. but its paid for itself - plus Ive got alot of "aftersale" help lol...
He's told me alot that he hasent put into the guide.

[nails]

dont takemy explianation literally, but it gives you an idea of what going on inside the fruit machines CPU. out of the blue they can still pick you that lucky number a do a JP when its clearly not ready, resulting in the owner payiong out more than usual.

having a small hopper is not sloppy programming, just poor on the half of the builder really. ive played a £675 jackpot that only had a £350 hopper.. stupid.

Attached Files

•  slutto.zip   949.59KB   150 downloads

[shaun2097]

regularplayer, you say that the guide has already paid for its self, so is there any chance of you attaching it to this thread so we can all have a laugh!!!

[stevedude2]

Hello All..

First Up thank you too nails - the above is the best explanation of the workings of S16'S I have read to date.

The only thing that leaves me a little confused about S16's is the fact they can quite often go short on a small float - I would have thought that will there advanced (ish) programming they would be protected from this, however they do this more often than any AWP for example.

As for the guide - I have found several of the low tech emptiers the most profitable - I also used the Magic Games trick last weekend in a local sega park - but alot are chipped.

ermm.. I dont feel the need to defend this guide!! its not great.. but its paid for itself - plus Ive got alot of "aftersale" help lol...
He's told me alot that he hasent put into the guide.

Trouble is a lot of what nails says is incorrect or sometimes complete bollocks. You can find lots of threads on here RegularPlayer where I have tried to explain to nails exactly how S16 machines work but he won't be convinced, and instead sticks to his own theories, some of which are simply not true. I have tried to put him straight a number of times on a few misconceptions/suspicions/conspiracy theories he has but he just isn't having any of it.

Take this very thread for example, where he states that the more games you play the more £500 balls go into the bag - meaning the more you play the better the chance you have of getting a jackpot. This statement flouts the most basic and fundamental rule of S16 machines, in that the player must have an equal chance on every game regardless of previous results. Also the comment he makes about £1000 and £1500 balls which trigger 'the' double or triple jackpot is also very wide of the mark. Finally the statement where he says he knew he was going to get a JP, and that if you get a run of semi-decent wins it counts as a mini-jackpot and removes the chance of a jackpot...what a f*****g load of utter bollocks.

I've got no problem with nails believeing this is so, as he is welcome to form his own opinions, but saying that this is definite fact is extremely stupid, as the only evidence he has to back it up is that it happened once for 'his mate'. Try playing the machine for 50 million games and then see if this still holds up!

More nails bullshit includes this gem -

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
out of the blue they can still pick you that lucky number a do a JP when its clearly not ready, resulting in the owner payiong out more than usual.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

If this sentence applies to S16 games then again the most basic cardinal rule of S16 guidelines is broken. The machine never knows what it has paid out so it can never be 'clearly not ready'. Why would manufacturers risk intentionally flouting these guidelines?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Party SLUTTO does however tens to give away when there is something in the pipeline. the reels go a fraction slower, and the adding up of the wins gets slower and slower untill you either get a few £25`s or you hit the JP. (i played one a few days ago in crawley. my first spin was really really slow, as was the £1.50 i won. a mere 5 spin later it gave me the JP)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

More bullshit, based on zero evidence. Here nails isn't expressing his own opinion, he is declaring it as fact.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
...slutto and random spinner however was down to the programmers either `sloppy` or purpose built emptier systems.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oh dear! Very unfortunate...


RegularPlayer I would suggest you read some of the threads on this site before making up your mind. The Party Games Slotto bug was never an emptier, and the Magic Games emptier would only work if you had 10 hours to do it and all the staff in the arcade walked round with their eyes shut.


AND FINALLY REMEMBER, THOSE THAT SELL EMPTIER GUIDES ARE OFTEN SKINT CON-MERCHANTS, BECAUSE IF THE INFO WAS ANY GOOD THEY WOULDN'T SELL IT, OR NEED TO SELL IT AS THEY WOULD HAVE PLENTY OF MONEY. FOR EXAMPLE THE GOLDEN GAME EMPTIER IS NOT AN EMPTIER, IT'S JUST A WAY OF GETTING SEVERAL POTS OUT IN A SHORT SPACE OF TIME. THE ONLY WAY YOU'LL EMPTY ONE IS IF YOU PUT £245 IN FOR £255 OUT OR SOME SHIT. IT'S ALL REFLEXED AND COMPENSATED FOR IN ANY CASE, OR THE MACHINES WOULD ALL BE CHIPPED TO f***.

[nails]

as i was typing that, i thought `how long will it take for stevedude2 to bite?`
and sure enough, out of the woodwork he pops.

i dont think ive ever stated it was fact. and, the fact that you bite so hard tends to suggest that you have strong views too. so why not share your views instead of stepping down hard on other people.

IT IS MY OWN OPINION AND THATS IT. (did i not say that last time?)

afaik your a programmer for some fruit machine company yes? i can understand that your probably contractually bound not to tell us trade secrets, but just to say not true, just doesnt hold up.

try telling people that on a party slutto, that has £2k pumped into it, is just as likely to pay as a slutto that did a jackpot £200 ago..

[stevedude2]

I don't normally feel moved to join in discussions such as this very much these days, as we've all been there - I've shared my views on a number of occasions.

In this thread though you are not expressing your opinion. You are making a statement. There is a big different between -

a) I think, or my view is that Section 16 games do this or that...

and

Section 16 games DO this or that...


As I said before, you're welcome to form your own opinions and say what you think. There's nothing wrong with me thinking that the sky is green, but if I go around telling people that it is green when I can't be sure of the facts, I'm going to look a complete twat.

This new member RegularPlayer - he's only been on the site 5 minutes and only posted a few times, and you're feeding him your opinions but dressing them up as statements of fact.

All I'm merely trying to do is clear up some of the misconceptions about these games. There are no trade secrets as far as these games go - it's all there in the Section 16 guidelines. These have to be followed by every company that manufactures a Section 16 game. Read them through and you'll see that most of the stuff you say doesn't hold water.

It's a bit like a policeman telling someone that if they commit murder they'll go to prison, but he's got some bloke in a pub saying at the same time that he'll only get a £60 fine.

Who should RegularPlayer believe? Someone who works for a manufacturer and has helped design and do the stats for these games, and therefore has all the facts and is qualified to explain how they work?

Or just some guy, who thinks he knows and is so convinced he is right, despite not reading any industry documentation or guidelines, that he thinks he can voice his opinions as cold hard facts?

You read too much into these games Nails! They are random games of Bingo dressed up as fruit machines!

And yes, I've told many people that you can't chase these games for jackpots, and that you have the same chance on every game. They don't necessarily want to hear that when they're 2K into one, but they asked me for the truth, and I gave it to them.

What more can I do?

[Winnie]

I own a Magic 500 - which is the same machine as Fortune / Vegas 500. I must say the more I play it (it has had about £30k through it) the more I don't believe they are random in the way we are led to believe. For example, if you play £10 a spin the jackpot comes lots and lots as you might expect, but if you get the jackpot on £10 a spin and then play £2 a spin - I have NEVER got the jackpot on £2 after playing through all the winnings from the £10 a spin game. I have done this every day almost for about 2 months and it takes the money back every time. Because the £2 and £10 games are different percentages they surely must have independant pay-out tables (they have to, on £10 a spin you get loads of big wins, on £2 hardly anything above £10)


Seems a little fishy to me.

[nails]

I own a Magic 500 - which is the same machine as Fortune / Vegas 500. I must say the more I play it (it has had about £30k through it) the more I don't believe they are random in the way we are led to believe. For example, if you play £10 a spin the jackpot comes lots and lots as you might expect, but if you get the jackpot on £10 a spin and then play £2 a spin - I have NEVER got the jackpot on £2 after playing through all the winnings from the £10 a spin game. I have done this every day almost for about 2 months and it takes the money back every time. Because the £2 and £10 games are different percentages they surely must have independant pay-out tables (they have to, on £10 a spin you get loads of big wins, on £2 hardly anything above £10)


Seems a little fishy to me.

you have the same mental block that i had. ive just got rid of my vegas500 and indeed had it on £10 a spin and lumpy profile. whilst i could never pin point exactley when the jp would drop, it (IN MY OPINION) would drop the jackpot from a hard reset, with £1k put in it. and it would then do a good few hundred in after play.

IN MY OPIONION closely watching the internal percentage was also a good clue as to when it *may* drop, perhaps this could be interpreted as a continuation of stevedude2 theory of the large bingo game, ie waiting for the last number untill the full house??

thats enough of this thread for me, whilst i do indeed truggle to accept steves theory, i will now keep an open mind- and wil TRY not to get involved with my own opinions on s16`s again...

[the_witty_welshman]

the only question left? is whether regularplayer is going to post his findings? let us all have a read, we are a community?? are we not? where we share information and knowledge.

[ady]

regularplayer, you say that the guide has already paid for its self, so is there any chance of you attaching it to this thread so we can all have a laugh!!!

I'd like to see it too........especially as the seller states that this is THE One.....

The speil goes along the lines of......All the others are out-of-date and buyers of the RF Manu's (sorry Maplins 2-way Radio's) are (quote) Idiots..................

[spa]

I'm sure I said in a different thread I have read this item, and it's complete shite.

I won't post it as someone did buy it for £10 and passed it on but believe me, it's nothing worth knowing.

[nails]

I'm sure I said in a different thread I have read this item, and it's complete shite.

I won't post it as someone did buy it for £10 and passed it on but believe me, it's nothing worth knowing.

f***`em - post it.

[the_witty_welshman]

f***`em - post it.

here here, send me all the info, and ill post it on ebay for half the price and donate the proceeds to fruit-emu????