46 replies to this topic

[Magz]

90% that'd be lucky. 86% or less is more likely to be the norm, especially once they've been around for a while...

[Bencrest]

When will we get to the point that fruit machines have to display their percentage electronically - say as part of the attract mode on the alpha display?

It wouldn't be the first time I've seen an AWP with an 80% sticker set to only 70%.

I know most of the Video based machines show the percentage either during the game, or as part of the information screen, but they tend to be set to higher percentages. I mean things like 'Party Time' machines. High throughput stuff.

Players should have a right to know exactly what the machine is set to, without having to rely on an old sticker which probably hasn't been changed in years.

[Magz]

What, you mean some sort of information on the gamble you are taking? Information to players? Any semblance of fairness to the average punter?

Never!!! .

[TwoBit]

Have to admit they do look horriable.

Since the introduction of the 50p machines i dont tend to play as much now as i did (unless been drinking ) so the new ones will probably give a wide birth unless their are some good feature board ones

[voodoomau5]

Aaaa welll hopefully £35ers will be cheap to buy now.




Deal or no deal power 5





10p Or best offer.

[manky]

its true ... the £500's can take up to £12'000 between jackpots ... they have been known to pay 2 £500's within a tenner but ive been told thats rare . in the old £2 a spin days the local arcade had a £500 project mega bars and it took over 6 months to pay its first jackpot ?????

[carlosgee]

i do laugh sometimes, i understand the basics of RNG's but how can they be completely random with a percentage sticker on, not sarcasm just v confused

[mart1711]

there are different ways b3's have their "randomness" calculated. One is a win from a huge pool of outcomes is deterfmined by the rng and then displayed as a relevant win on the reels. Others are by the reel layouts themselves and good old mathematics!!! Imagine a simple 3 reel machine, each reel having 3 stops. 2 stops are "o's" and 1 stop "x's". If each spin of the reels is totally random then there would be a mathematical 1 in 27 chance of the 3 x's landing on the payline. If the machine costs £1 a go and the only win available was 3 x's for a jacpot of £25 then the payout % would be as follows (25/27)*100 >>> 92.6%. Factor in many other reel stops on machines and different wins thats how its done. Thiks is why JP's can be far apart of sometimes close together. If a JP rolls in on one spin, it is just as likely (or not) to come in on the next spin!!

[rizzla37]

its true ... the £500's can take up to £12'000 between jackpots ... they have been known to pay 2 £500's within a tenner but ive been told thats rare . in the old £2 a spin days the local arcade had a £500 project mega bars and it took over 6 months to pay its first jackpot ?????

wheres that arcade??....makes mental note never to go near it

[jamesb99_1999]

The machines are random so there's no catching up - they might take 1 million between jackpots or they may take one pound, that's why they are called random.

The machines in the photos have the jackpot on bottom reels and top as far as I am aware and the top reels are the streak like party time/ double decker unless I am wrong - as they are astras the same it makes sense for them to use the formula that has worked for them.

[barxfan]

The Pure Gold is a reglass of Bullion Bars with double the stake and win values.

Others are reglasses of Party Time/Double Decker by the looks of it.

[cliffc]

When will we get to the point that fruit machines have to display their percentage electronically - say as part of the attract mode on the alpha display?

It wouldn't be the first time I've seen an AWP with an 80% sticker set to only 70%.

I know most of the Video based machines show the percentage either during the game, or as part of the information screen, but they tend to be set to higher percentages. I mean things like 'Party Time' machines. High throughput stuff.

Players should have a right to know exactly what the machine is set to, without having to rely on an old sticker which probably hasn't been changed in years.

Hi

There are machines that do show the percentage in the lcds now, some of the Concept Games kits for the electrocoin rainge show the percentage in attract mode in the Credit LED's.

Cliff C

[Steveir]

When will they learn? Sticking up jp's and stakes are driving people away yet they still think thats what people want

[nails]

considering some of you guys have been here longer than me, i cant believe how thick ppl are.

There are 2 types of random machines out there, a classic barcrest cashino or elvis is known as a payout controlled random, and the slotto of this world is known as a random random.

Controlled random is offet by recent wins, but is in any case still random, therfore even a good £200 win say, can still be followed up by a jackpot. You would have to deduce that it had a £700 win in it.

Random payout random machines can still be thought of as like the old bingo machines that pulls out numbers, eventually it will do a jackpot and then the balls are reset. To explain slotto doing a treble is best described as slotto pulling a £1500 number and then paying that out over the next XX amount of spins.

As to the payout of a machine. I always thought that a rock bottom was 72%, and 68% for oil rigs (dont ask). this is not the case as i had a batch of machines that could be set to 70%.

THERE ARE ONLY RANDOM WITHIN THEIR PARAMETES

To think the new machines will be a high percentage is pure speculation, although in reality setting it on the £1 option would indeed increase the payout, however assuming the 25p/30p option was at the lower end of the 70`s is to me obvious. I have no doubt that even on £1 a spin, pubs would be looking at 78% and arcades even lower.

[Bencrest]

considering some of you guys have been here longer than me, i cant believe how thick ppl are.

If ever there were an excuse to give up gambling, it's an arcade operator telling his punters they are thick. Still, please continue...

There are 2 types of random machines out there, a classic barcrest cashino or elvis is known as a payout controlled random, and the slotto of this world is known as a random random.

Please tell me where the Gambling Act 2005 refers to 'random random' and 'payout controlled random'. It doesn't. The machines don't state 'hey, I'm random, but this type of random', they merely state :

'THIS MACHINE IS RANDOM'.

Do you have signs up in your arcade to inform your players? Exactly.

As to the payout of a machine. I always thought that a rock bottom was 72%, and 68% for oil rigs (dont ask). this is not the case as i had a batch of machines that could be set to 70%.

I'd always hoped that arcade operators would have a knowledge of gaming law, but apparently anyone can open an arcade these days without actually knowing something as simple as a 2 digit number followed by a '%' sign. It beggars belief, I mean a 16 year old working in Argos would be expected to know the APR% of their credit service, so why the hell can't an arcade operator be expected to know the payout % of a machine?

What if the legal minimum were 78%... but you 'thought' it were 70%?

Either you know, or you don't - and if you don't, you shouldn't be allowed a license.

THERE ARE ONLY RANDOM WITHIN THEIR PARAMETES

... They are only random within their parameters?

To think the new machines will be a high percentage is pure speculation, although in reality setting it on the £1 option would indeed increase the payout, however assuming the 25p/30p option was at the lower end of the 70`s is to me obvious. I have no doubt that even on £1 a spin, pubs would be looking at 78% and arcades even lower.

If your arcade operates on LOWER than a pub setting, that's downright offensive, as pubs tend to offer the worst value-for-money game these days.

Why did you even get into the business, as it seems you have total comtempt for the players you rely on for trade?

[nails]

Didnt you quit once?

[nails]

its true ... the £500's can take up to £12'000 between jackpots ... they have been known to pay 2 £500's within a tenner but ive been told thats rare . in the old £2 a spin days the local arcade had a £500 project mega bars and it took over 6 months to pay its first jackpot ?????

i had an old random spinner on £2 play, i played over £3k through it without a jackot.

[Bencrest]

Didnt you quit once?

Yeah, but I quit because I was forced out by small-minded idiots, and realised that I couldn't let those idiots win.

You can at least appreciate where I'm coming from? If someone who runs these machines doesn't know the law - then how the hell are others supposed to know?

[levartemit186]

Lets face it, the UK is not ready for truly random machines. I visit the USA frequently, and this is all they have known. We have grown comfortable in the knowledge that enough throughput will eventually secure the JP or big win. It is not so in other parts of the world, why do you think Vegas with all its machines random is so sucessful? We look at machines as 'accumulators', enough in will produce results. Randomisation precludes any guarantees, you could play FOREVER without getting a JP in theory. Our little JP machines (yes LITTLE compared to elsewhere) have for years produced results we expect. The increase in RNG gameplay is going to change the way we view fruits. Do I prefer US slots? No, I like our fruits with features, skill and some determinism. Will this stop manus like Barcrest ( who with IGT in the States make a lot of random machines) trying to impose this on us with promise of huge returns? Hell No!

Whether the punter likes this or not is of no consequence, we will eventually embrace random, or be lost by the wayside. The UK of A!

[gambogaz1]

If your arcade operates on LOWER than a pub setting, that's downright offensive, as pubs tend to offer the worst value-for-money game these days.

Why did you even get into the business, as it seems you have total comtempt for the players you rely on for trade?

Unfortunately Bencrest that's a regular thing now.My local silverspoons has Rovers/Rob da bank/Open the box/Road 2 riches/Pokerface & Starwars. Only Rovers is on 80% the rest are all on 70%.Pubs generally now are 74%-78% except reds which tend to get sited on 70% now also.

I agree fully with your post though, for an arcade owner to show such little knowledge shows what us as players are up against. How can we challenge anything if the owner doesn't know what's right or wrong themselves. Just shows how easy it is for operators to rip us off with us not having a leg to stand on.