10 replies to this topic

[fistandantilus]

You can never win!! Not continually, it's mostly down to luck, and a tiny tiny smidge of skill that may give you a small advantage from time to time. Play the emulator and see the pattern. you soon lose the urge to throw real money in them, if your brain works!!

this seems to be of an opinion that emulation is likely to stop people playing real fruit machines in favour of emulation.

I disagree totally, if you go to an arcade you don't just pick a machine and play on it none stop or at least i never did. The secret to a smart gambler is to find a machine you know, put in a few credits to try and get a feel of where in its pay cycle it is and then either give the machine up as a bad job and move to another or try and make a quick profit and then move on and repeat the process.

How many of you who know a gambler who tells you "don't get stuck on a machine", i know several, we all know you can't beat a single machine in the long term but with luck, skill and knowledge you can beat "them". The true skills comes from recognising when your gonna take a kicking and minimising the damage.

The fun comes from being that one step ahead of the machine, or at least thinking you were when you misread the signs. You noticed that after a jackpot you almost always get a quick feature straight afterwards. Knowledge usually tells you you can add maybe £2 -£3 to your jackpot before you leave the machine. You know after that one feature the machine is gonna die on you and recoup its loss. Doesn't always happen you could put half the jackpot in chasing that first feature but then after several credits you should have realised this and minimized your loss.



This is where emulation comes in, gaining experience and knowlege. Experience is everything and this is why i never play new machines, that and the fact they are shite lol. If i could test the new machines on an emulator them maybe i would play them.

Machines make profit not on what type of people play them but how many credits go through them. Besides seeing a machine paying out is good advertising, Why do you thing they have fancy jackpot jingles and make such a racket paying out. More people who play emulators the more people likely to play the machines. Free advertising.

All this taken into consideration I can't see how emulation could damage the industry

[Scmooster]

this seems to be of an opinion that emulation prevents people playing real fruit machines

Why? It doesn't say anything of the kind, how can it prevent anything? To prevent means to impede, why would using an emulator impede you playing a real machine? The opinionee is actually 'of the opinion' that anyone with half a brain can see from playing 'a multitude of machines' (not one) that the long term gains for 'Mr Joey average player' are minimal to nilimal, it was actually directed at those that play machines and lose a lot of money regularly; and where does it mention anything about sticking to one machine? The whole point of the emulator is it allows you to play as many as you like. It wasn't an opinion on professional gambling, this is: In my opinion professional gamblers are an extremely tiny proportion of those that gamble. That is to say, someone who makes a living out of gambling belongs to the tiniest of minorities, and even less are professional fruit machine gamblers. Why would a professional gambler use an emulator that's at least 3 years behind current technology to learn from? He wouldn't, so who would then?
Me and a whole load of others who neither are, nor were ever, professional gamblers.

[fistandantilus]

I should have linked or maybe quoted all the article but if i can refind the link i will add it, you bounced all over my arguement of just the quote rather than the entire jist. but from this snipet you should be able to gain the insite i wanted....

Play the emulator and see the pattern. you soon lose the urge to throw real money in them, if your brain works!

This seems to suggest to me that playing an emulator will make you less likely to play the real thing. This is why barcrest etc are scared of the emulation scene, they think people will just play the emulator and not bother with the real thing. Your not helping the cause with that attitude. I was simply trying to put across another point of view before you blundered in with your size 16's. I don't consider my friends or anyone I know for that matter professional gamblers, although being of an age where i have seen just about every machine emulated here from the earliest to the latest and having played most of them for real I know of what I speak. To be professional implies to make your living of it I don't. I just play for fun and if I make a profit all the better. I am aware of how costly it can be as well as anyone.

If you gamble all the time you will lose, the odds are against you. What I am on about is those who maybe visit an arcade one a month with £20 say and hope to have an entire afternoons fun. Then you can win and I have many a times walked away with more money then I entered with. This is not been a pro, simply experience has taught me how to edge my bets if you like. The rest is down to a bit of luck, (going on the right machine at the right time, and avoiding that fateful machine that absolutely scanks you.)


I personally think fruit machines have taken a step back in sophistication. Ok the sound and light shows maybe more advanced but I fail to see in anyway how they might have advanced program wise. The ideal program is fun so that it becomes addictive. It lures you in, it makes you think the machine is on the edge of paying out so you just need that one last credit. That you are one more spin away from the feature that gives you a generous gold win series. This si the magic that is lacking in modern programing. You need to go back to what is referred to the golden age when classics such as indian jones, rollercoaster, bonanza, pyramid, bullseye, and many other machines were about. They were fun to play because they gave you a rollercoaster type ride, up and down with slow bits , thrilling bits, ok eventually if you played long enough you reached the bottom but you had fun on the way down. Not a bad analogy looking back lol

Modern machines ie last few years don't do that, they are simple hence boring. Its just keep trying until the block is removed and then hope the feature you take doesn't rob you or the jackpot repeats. How many machines require you to really think , with clever little exchanges and different ways of reaching the jackpot with different skills used. This is why less people play and why they have to increase the stakes to try and tempt players. Increasing the stake also gets a bigger profit from less plays. Personally i think the industry has shot itself in the foot. I haven't seen a good machine in ages, they are very seldom these days.

[Scmooster]

You're perfectly entitled to your opinions, as am I, but the response above shows how you feel when someone misreads them or takes them out of context as a basis for an argument. (you said yourself you totally disagree, hence argument, i.e. a difference of opinion) I couldn't care less what you think, all that bothered me was the fact you thought you needed a snippet of my opinion as the basis for a rant, and as you were literally contesting my point of view I think I'm perfectly entitled to come blundering back across it with whatever I like, you're twisting half what I'm saying and implying the rest. If you don't want me involved in your arguments then don't drag me into them.

[Monopoly60v8]

this seems to be of an opinion that emulation prevents people playing real fruit machines.

After playing the emulators for a while I thought I had enough knowledge to 'beat the machine' (yeah right), So at first it did incease my playing of real fruit machines, but I quickly realised that it doesn't really make a difference how much knowledge you have, if it doesn't want to pay out then it wont!

[Jez_Shaw]

...if it doesn't want to pay out then it wont!

Conversely if it wants to pay it will, no matter how skilled the player is. To illustrate the point, In the pub where I work, we have a JPM machine (forget the name, but it has a curry theme). The other day, one of the regulars was playing the machine when it offered her an IM, being ignorant of it's play, she didn't realise, and collected on about £4. The machine then proceeded to give her 5 IM's back to back and every time she took a win of between £3 & £5. In the end she still walked away £40 to the good (I know, cos I changed the coins back into notes. makes you think doesn't it? If I had played the machine, I would obvously have gone for the Jackpot on the first IM. The chances are that there would probably have been another £10 to £15 in afterplay or maybe another jackpot - the same result. Hmmm :-? :-? :-?

[senorcox]

I just wanted to chime in from a novice emulator/slot player prospective. I went to Europe (laid over in London) and played many different types of machines. I remember the Mario game in the lounge at the airport first. I was amazed at the features and bonus games and was hooked. Not ever hearing about these machines, I did not know that the hi/lo gamble was pretty much rigged (hitting 12's after pressing lo for an 11 numerous times). So I continually played and played and of course lost a lot. Had I known then what I have learned by playing these machines, I would have never put my money in any of them.

I hit my fair share of 80 Euro Jackpots on some of the Spain machines but let's face it, I was addicted to them and lost more than I care to remember. Blame it on ignorance, novelty, and age, but I had to learn a hard lesson, try as hard as you may, unless you "know" the machine, you're destined to lose.

Here's my take on emulators and the industry. I can see how, if I had the deep pockets, I would use the knowledge of the machines to play and possibly win. Getting into the cycle and knowing when the machine pays is an art and some people can take this information and make money off the machine. Sure, they would make a profit, but the machine would recover down the road on people like me. So, I don't see emulators hurting the industry that way.

However, there could be a slight decrease in casual pub players if they see how the machines work and see how they are destined to lose. Instead of placing those few pounds into a machine thinking it is about to pay, they might spend the money elsewhere. I know from what I have learned on these machines that I would be less likely to play in the future. I've played many of the machines on here and since I don't have all the knowledge like most of you, I have lost a LOT of fake pounds.

So, the industry might lose a few casual players along the way but I really don't think the industry will be hurting too much as new machines and new technologies are introduced.

SenorCox

[Bencrest]

[quote name='Jez_Shaw][quote=Monopoly60v8'] ...if it doesn't want to pay out then it wont![/quote]

Conversely if it wants to pay it will, no matter how skilled the player is. To illustrate the point, In the pub where I work, we have a JPM machine (forget the name, but it has a curry theme). The other day, one of the regulars was playing the machine when it offered her an IM, being ignorant of it's play, she didn't realise, and collected on about £4. The machine then proceeded to give her 5 IM's back to back and every time she took a win of between £3 & £5. In the end she still walked away £40 to the good (I know, cos I changed the coins back into notes. makes you think doesn't it? If I had played the machine, I would obvously have gone for the Jackpot on the first IM. The chances are that there would probably have been another £10 to £15 in afterplay or maybe another jackpot - the same result. Hmmm :-? :-? :-?[/quote]

Just popping in V.quickly, loads of work to do

Vinda Loot, JPM, is basically a clone of all the Jackpot Junction / Count Yer Cash BFM/Mazooma machines, normally offer loads of nudges with no real win, great at killing on cherries [higher than a 2] e.t.c.....

In my experience its normally 2xIM followed by say £10 from shots [super or normal or some good afterplay = to £10.

I agree entirely with the 'if it can't pay it won't', and if anyone thinks to the contrary, I sure hope I'm the person that goes on after them

EDIT: To the contrary as in 'I'm guarenteed to make a profit because I know the machine inside out'.....

BarcrestBenito [might pop back in a week or so, got 4 maths, 2 physics and 2 computer papers to do this weekend ]

[mrmystery83]

I've posted this before but ultimately if you play the machines on a regular basis then you'll never really be 'up' in the long term as long as you don't delude yourself otherwise then you'll be ok. If you are then that's a sign if a true addict. Look at it this way you never see a arcade owner/bookie riding a push bike do ya? Nah got decent motors and who pays for them? We do lol

[fistandantilus]

who said anything about been guarenteed to make a profit, Its like horse racing. Having a knowledge about the horse, jockey , course and weather conditions improves your chances over nothing. This could help you to push the odds in your favour. But the granny with no idea is likely still to show you up from time to time because luck is vital in any form of gambling from the simple heads or tails to getting good cards in poker. As for "a machine not paying out if it don't want to", this is my point, with experience you can tell if they are about to pay or are about to rip and just leave it for someone else to replenish. . Why people try to force machines is beyond me, its rarely succesfull and more likely to end in tears.

As for being an addict? I haven't played a real fruit machine in months or gambled on anything, why?
Because all the new machines are extremely dull and the older classic machines are getting harder and harder to find.

The only tips worth knowing are -

If a machine don't want to pay out its worthless putting money in
Three £5 wins is just as good as a £15 Jackpot,
Taking a £7 win off a couple of £ if your lucky and moving on to another is the same as winning a £25 after putting £20 in.
For gawds sake , don't! get stuck on a machine that don't want to pay out,
Repeat for gawds sake don't get stuck on a machine that don't want to pay out

I try to stick to these rules and as you say while it don't guarentee nothing I tend to at least get a very good amount of play time for a modest stake.

[mrmystery83]

You can't always know if a machine is gonna pay out or not. I heard that if the reels are going really fast then lave the fruity alone. A rule i used until i put £3 in Monopoly £25 jacky the reels were really spinning quick but i got IM for a repeat jacky. I agree that it's better to come off a bit up then down though but just depends on if ya reckon it's worth the risk